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The Dyatlov Pass Incident
#11
Jadewik

The investigation was conducted by professionals and they stated that the damage is what killed them and was comparable to a car crash. Snow would not cause a sudden impact like that unless it was an avalanche, which was determined not to have happened. Also, one of the first discovered victims, who wasn't discovered in deep snow also had a cracked skull. Also, the tent was determined to have been torn apart from the inside.

This is why i find this occurance so strange. This incident has been investigated many times with no explanation.
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#12
The "force of a car crash" is equivalent to the force of that much snow. Also, avalanches can be localized and smaller. I still wouldn't rule it the possibility of an avalanche out-- who was there to witness whether one happened or not that wouldn't have died if one did occur.

You also have to consider that this event happened in the late 1950s, when forensic science was just a baby-- in the US, even! Taking into account the time in which the event occurred, the lack of forensic and modern science... and the lack of records. I'd say it's pretty well explain-able.

Do you have a link to the autopsy reports? I personally wouldn't trust hearsay.... but if you have a link to an official autopsy report or record indicating that the damage was what killed them, I'd be interested in seeing it. It might help prove your point more; Though, it wouldn't explain why the buried bodies incurred damage and the ones that were not buried wouldn't include damage.

... I really hate to see modern science excluded and replaced with the investigative resources of the late 1950's... just because we want to believe something was paranormal doesn't mean it is... for all we know today's forensic science may have solved the case... UNR and I certainly have provided plenty of possible, rational explanations.

If you don't want to hear alternate theories, fine. It was the boogey-man. However, I believe it was just a cold night and a bunch of people who were in the wrong place got hypothermia and died.
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#13
I'm sorry, i don't have a link to an autopsy but you have to remember that the investigation was conducted by locals who are used to finding bodies in avalanches, and so forth, in those mountains. There is a long history of people dying in the same group of mountains every winter and this one stuck out as a mystery to the professional investigators. They had no doubt that there was no avalanche. There have also been many subsequent investigations of the event, the latest one happening two years ago, i believe, and there has never been an answer, not even a hypothesis.

It's not that i don't want to hear alternate explanations but those ideas have already been looked at many times and have been proven time and time again to not be true.

That's why i added it, even after modern investigations, it is still unexplainable.
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#14
Judging from the photos found in this article:
http://www.sptimes.ru/story/25093

I agree. It doesn't look as though there was an avalanche at the site-- especially after seeing this photo of the tent that was found:
http://www.sptimes.ru/index.php?action_i...to_id=5260
(Link because I don't want to hot-link and steal bandwidth)

I do have other possible scientific explanations though. They were in the Ural mountains. They say Yudin "fell ill" but I'm wondering what caused the illness-- and I'm recalling the book "Into Thin Air" by John Krakauer about the Mt Everest disaster.... and the circumstances swirling around the Dyatlov Pass deaths make me think of Pulmonary Edema and Hypoxia. One of the crew members on the Mt. Everest trip took off his oxygen tank, stripped down to his undergarments, and almost walked off the mountain... so hypoxia or altitude sickness could have caused behavior that would be similar to stripping down and leaving tents. The symptoms of hypoxia could also have caused discoloured skin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypoxia_(medical)
Quote:In the case of altitude sickness, where hypoxia develops gradually, the symptoms include headaches, fatigue, shortness of breath, a feeling of euphoria and nausea. In severe hypoxia, or hypoxia of very rapid onset, changes in levels of consciousness, seizures, coma, priapism, and death occur. Severe hypoxia induces a blue discolouration of the skin, called cyanosis. Because hemoglobin is a darker red when it is not bound to oxygen (deoxyhemoglobin), as opposed to the rich red colour that it has when bound to oxygen (oxyhemoglobin), when seen through the skin it has an increased tendency to reflect blue light back to the eye. In cases where the oxygen is displaced by another molecule, such as carbon monoxide, the skin may appear 'cherry red' instead of cyanotic.

I also recommend some light reading on Altitude Sickness, which may also explain what happened.
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#15
Jadewik

Yudin turned back before they reached the mountain.

That still doesn't explain the damage done to the bodies or the traces of radiation. It also doesn't explain how every member ripped through the tent in terror, when that person you mentioned on Mount Everest was most likely at a higher altitude and he was the only one of his group who acted that way. Another thing is that this didn't happen to the rescuers at the location, some of them staying over night, or to other hikers who go through the area. Other people have died in the mountain but not in any similiar way to this group, usually hypothermia.

Also, altitude sickness was looked into as a possible explanation but nothing happened with it because of lack of evidence.

I'm not trying to contradict everything you say but i'm finding holes in your theory.
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#16
While strictly speculation the article at the address below (in my opinion) makes the most sense based on the information we have.

http://skeptoid.com/episode.php?id=4108&comments=all
Belief bias occurs when we make illogical conclusions in order to confirm our preexisting beliefs. Belief perseverance refers to our tendency to maintain a belief even after the evidence we used to form the belief is contradicted.
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#17
I know Yudin turned back. It says he was sick. The question I'm asking is what sort of sickness had Yudin experienced? Was it a cold? Was it frostbite? Hypothermia? Hypoxia? Edema?

If Yudin experienced something that would make him turn around... then maybe someone else also did also, but later in the night. Maybe one person flipped out, ripped through the tent in terror and ran into the darkness and others followed to try and bring them back into the tent.

The injuries can be explained...
The minor head wound could be from tripping and stumbling in the dark. Hit your head on a tree. Trip and fall on a rock. Get elbowed in the head in your haste to leave the tent.

The major injuries, as I said before, were probably from the crushing impact of being covered in 12-feet of snow-- possibly an avalanche that occurred away from the campsite. The article UNR cited indicates slopes of up to 30-degrees in the area that would warrant an avalanche. The photo indicates that if there was an avalanche, it didn't happen at the tents; however, there is no photograph indicating that there wasn't one in the area near the bodies (my original argument against avalanche was only for the tent site) that were buried in 12-feet of snow! Ergo, the possibility that there was an avalanche away from the camp site still exists... unless it's ruled out by the evidence.... could it have been a "small" avalanche? Something relatively "normal" that would have gone unnoticed by locals in the area?

That, or they got lost, froze... and were crushed under 12-feet of snow-- was there heavy snowfall in the area that day? How do you account for such deep snow in that area other than avalanche or heavy snowfall? Preservation from the icy conditions may have made it seem as though the bodies were crushed before death... or as they died (if it were an avalanche they would have been injured and probably died from those injuries-- it's not unheard of).

The missing tongue-- again from animals in the area. They were in the forest in the winter. Something was bound to run across the bodies. Or, as UNR's article suggests, the girl had bit off her tongue.

Radiation... I think is moot, which is why I haven't mentioned anything about it. That was in the days before people really knew a lot about radiation-- clock makers from that era would use uranium to paint the hands of clocks. They'd lick their brushes to get the tips straight... many of them died from radiation poisoning and have radioactive bones from their clock-painting days. UNR's article also suggests it was radiation from the lantern wicks... also plausible. They could have also been walking through a military test site. Maybe they knew someone who worked with radiation... who knows. There really isn't enough evidence to suggest radiation was a factor in their deaths-- even the autopsy suggests they died from crushing wounds and hypothermia.

I'm unsure of how you claim to be finding "holes" in my "theory"... I haven't actually posted a single theory. I've been posting LOGICAL POSSIBILITIES that COULD explain certain things that happened. Rule the possibilities out with logic and science and you narrow things down a bit.

Yes, it's likely they all weren't suffering from hypoxia.... but COULD one of them have been? That's the question you should be asking yourself. Lack of evidence doesn't rule something out as a possibility, it only means it cannot be determined from the evidence provided if it did or did not happen-- the possibility does exist. I haven't looked up the elevation of the area, but elevation sickness is the sort of thing that normally happens at higher altitudes, though it CAN happen at lower altitudes as well. On the Everest trip, they actually had to take someone down to basecamp and air evacuate them because they couldn't make it to the next camp before turning back due to Pulmonary Edema. Whereas the fellow who flipped out and started taking his clothes off and almost walked off the mountain did so at a much higher elevation-- very near the top of Everest.

Chances are, that something else spooked one of the Dyatlov skiiers... something drove one of them, at least, to leave the tent in a hurry. There are several things to "fear" in the dark... in the woods... on a snowy mountainside... The others may have followed in an attempt to bring the fellow back... or they could have followed being equally scared of what the first one ran out. Fear is contagious in a group setting and if one person flips, the rest will likely follow.

What you should ask yourself is "What would cause one experienced mountaineer/cross-country skier to leave their tent in such a hurry?"

You seem to be trying to rule out logical explanations, while I seem to want to provide them... If you want to believe it was paranormal, that's fine. I don't think it was.

... I think people tend to put supernatural causes on events that are unexplainable because they haven't yet found the reason. If evidence isn't collected and kept, these mysteries may never be solved... which is why this one is still marked as "unknown"-- there just isn't enough evidence to prove much of anything except they left their tents and died.
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#18
The problem with that article that UNR brings up is that the investigation proved that there was NO AVALANCHE. I don't know how many times i have to say that. That's why this has still stuck as a mystery, there was no evidence of where their injuries came from.

I'm a skeptic as much as the next guy but there are also people called blind skeptics, who refuse to believe certain pieces of evidence because it doesn't fit into their view of what happened, it's similiar to conspiracy theorists who disregard pieces of evidence even if it has been proven. I'm starting to believe you are a blind skeptic.

THERE WAS NO AVALANCHE. It was explicitely proven and was a point in many subsequent investigations.
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#19
Wow.You guys can really break that down.I got lost in the math somewhere but I guess there's not a lot expect from a 14 year old who doesn't do too well in math anyways.Great story though Bracket.Notice how weird things happen on May 4th.There was something else disturbing that happened on May 4th that I read about(probly online through google).I'm starting to think that I was born on an unlucky day....lol
"These are the darkest clouds that have surrounded me"-Within Temptation
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#20
One thing i'd like to add is that all high altitude explanations can be thrown out because a simple wikipedia search shows that what is considered "high altitude" is 2400 meters above sea level while the highest point of the treeline on the whole mountain pass is at 1400 meters, and if you read the story, they were found in the woods.
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